It's outrageous we spend time and tax dollars defending criminals who should never have been on our shores at all to activist far left judges or anyone else. Yet here we are. If you are a leftist, and not sure just where you settle in--I think you are a civil libertarian at least which is commendable --, they may win a few of these idiot battles and lose the war. Because 80% of the people want them out. Many of them will self deport if they know they might end up in an El Salvadoran prison. So the problem will disappear swiftly. Every one here illegally is a law breaker. My mother told me if I broke laws or hung around with those that do, if I hang out in the gutter, the stink will transfer to me. However, this kind of thinking does NOT apply to US citizens. They do deserve due process. It sounds like you are applying constitutional rights that belong to our citizens to noncitizens who have broken our laws. Some more than others.
Now I know they abused the Patriot Act beyond 911 issues and that is a worry (though again, they are not citizens like the Patriot Act was used against US citizens), but these people have to go. We are talking about organized gangs. Once Trump gets a handle on this, I believe families or less attached individuals will get closer scrutiny.
An important function of the courts is to defend people, per our laws, from the opinions of the majority. It doesn’t matter if 80% of people want them out if doing so would break the law - even if the people being sent out broke laws themselves.
It is settled law that all people inside our borders, not just citizens, have the same right to due process. By “same right” I mean they are understood to come from the exact same legal text. You may think that it shouldn’t be that way, but it *is* that way until Congress amends the Constitution.
It would be an extremely tiny group saying we shouldn’t deport foreign gang members if they are in fact dangerous people. The *problem* here is that without due process, those being deported have no chance to prove that they’re not gang members, or even that they’re citizens. If *you* were picked up because I tipped to the police that you were a TdA member, I think you would be very upset not to have a chance to prove that you’re not.
ps. We DO have a right to deport people here illegally. That's all we need to know. I can prove I'm a US citizen. They cannot. AND they are gang members. So this is ludicrous.
I’m sure you can prove that. What would you do if you showed your documents to an immigration official and they chucked you on the plane anyway? *That* is what is being alleged here. What is being alleged is that the government knows *some* *specific* people being deported are not actually legally deportable, and without being allowed to go in front of a judge, they are not being a given a chance to stop their deportation. What would you do if that was happening to you?
Well, I wouldn't be hanging around with a bunch of gang members or noncitizens when everyone and their brother knows they are going to be deported for being illegal. I suggest they don't do that. Or self deport so it doesn't happen to them. And I do not believe we are rounding up US citizens and sending them to El Salvador. So get real.
By the way, we have the right to free association in this country. I should be able to hang out with whoever I want to - that’s not illegal, and is not punishable by law. If they are being charged with being near gang members…that’s not a crime and it’s not deportable.
Who’s to say they were hanging around them? You are assuming too much. One allegation is that a man was just grabbed off the street because of his tattoos, which have no connection to gangs. How would he prove his innocence? How would we prove his danger to the public? By bringing him in front of a court. https://newrepublic.com/post/192861/trump-deport-immigrants-tattoos
No it is not "settled law" that noncitizens have the same rights. That's not true. They are not protected under our constitution, even with a green card if they are national security risks. And we extend those rights as a courtesy generally, but that's not true and IS debated.
And that's how Obama and Bill Clinton did it. They put all the illegals who came here through due process court cases. No, they did not. And we aren't going to. Obama issued "removal orders." What is the difference? The difference is that Donald Trump has to live under special laws. Check it out:
You think they all had trials?
"While Goodman is right that Obama deported record numbers of people using removal orders, she goes too far with her claim. “President Obama deported more people than all presidents before him combined,” she said on “Reliable Sources.”
Removal data from DHS going back to fiscal year 1892 show that while Obama did issue far more removal orders than his predecessors, 3.1 million removals from FY 2009 to FY 2016, it is still less than the 4.6 million issued before Obama took office."
Ethan, people can be deported for being here illegally with no green card and if they violate our laws, they can be deported even with one. It's that simple. We have deported people without court cases for years, even Barrack Obama did that! It's just Trump you all carry on over. Nobody carried on when he did it. They called him "deporter and chief." How many due process court cases did you see then?
I presume you are a liberal who thought it was fine to open the border and break our laws to begin with. If they came here illegally, they are criminals. And we cannot afford to put them all through court cases to get rid of them. Actually, it's Biden who should go to jail for doing it.
But we do not have to tolerate these drug people and gangs here. Look at the tv. Do they look like fine upstanding people to you? And once they are gone, I am sure some of the others will get your "due process." Or looked at more carefully.
What "due process" did Laken Riley get and those other victims?
And PS, noncitizens get due process int his country before we put them in OUR JAILS or keep them there permanently (as you see we did for that person who killed Laken Riley) . But we always HAVE used "removal orders" and deported people without trials. Because nobody can afford to hold a trial for every illegal. HELLO. And not just Donald Trump. ALL presidents do it.
Did Obama, deporter in chief, give them all court due process? Fuck no, he didn't. And HE built those cages on t he border. That was all fine, though. There are always two sets of rules for liberals. It's sickening.
There are a few hundred who are gang members Trump pardoned 1500 convicted people from 1/4
All the stuff about sending rapists, murderers, drug dealers are lies 80%of drugs come through major checkpoints and 80% are brought in by Americans
Obama, did, in fact have more deportations than any other president, including Trump
Illegal immigrants have the lowest crime rates Next are legal immi9grants the most are us born citizens Criminals should be deported first Even though they say they are doing that they have not done it If they are truly that concerned about law breakers
No, ALL illegal people have never received "due process." They have been removed by "removal orders" and none any moreso than Obama. And OBAMA built the cages. Maybe you should be more informed.
Right On!!! Where does it say in our Constitution, Bill of Rights, Preamble, etc. that people who enter our nation illegally have any rights under the law of common sense thinking.
I know you will walk away from this feeling like you’re right. I will think I’m right too. There doesn’t seem to be any more reason to argue if you’re going to tiptoe around each point I bring up instead of addressing them head on.
Ethan, here is what is on the US gov. site and what Obama and many presidents did before. They CAN be removed without seeing a judge and all these people fit the justification:
Understand the deportation process
Learn how the deportation process works and how to get help if you are facing deportation.
Deportation is the process of removing a noncitizen from the U.S. for violating immigration law.
The U.S. may detain and deport noncitizens who:
Participate in criminal acts
Are a threat to public safety
Violate their visa
What happens when someone is detained by immigration
The foreign national may be held in a detention center before trial or deportation. Find out how to locate someone detained by ICE.
After a noncitizen is detained, they may go before a judge in immigration court during the deportation (removal) process. In some cases, a noncitizen is subject to expedited removal without being able to attend a hearing in immigration court. Expedited removal may happen when a noncitizen:
LOL, address my points head on, Ethan. Obama issued "removal orders" more than any other president before him. He did NOT hold "trials." And give every illegal alien "due process." No president does. Now if they go to jail here for MURDER, they get due process. But this is naive and ridiculous. ALL presidents "remove" illegal aliens. Even Biden did it.
Gabe, will you explain what it means that Israel resuming its attacks puts the ceasefire into uncertainty? As far as I can tell, it plainly means the ceasefire is over. Am I not correct?
If the Supreme Court doesn’t have the ability to enforce their decisions, why would the current administration pay any attention if it does serve their interests?
I am noticing less reference to “ Biden judges, Trump judges, Obama judges in MSM. Am I imagining this? Or maybe wishful thinking? I noticed you are still using such terms. Maybe everyone should follow Justice John Roberts in this regard.
Due process is not a one size fits all magic concept. The process to which one is due in a mortgage default, a child custody case, a criminal prosecution etc. differs. We have an articulated process due to those who claim asylum. But that process became overburdened by the numbers of seekers, many of whom are not eligible. If we had a functioning Congress, the process would have been streamlined and properly funded long ago, after the Mariel Boatlift, or at least by 2014 when we all saw what was happening in Europe. The asylum law which was designed to respond to a different time would have been changed.
You wrote: (*emphasis* added below to your word “hours”)
“
At the same time, the administration is also battling allegations of non-compliance in another high-profile dispute, over its Friday deportation of Brown University professor Rasha Alawieh on Friday, despite a district judge ordering *hours* earlier that she not be removed from the U.S. without giving the court advance notice.
In a court filing made public Monday, a member of the legal team representing Alawieh said she was at the airport Friday night as the court petition was filed and informed a CBP officer who identified himself only as Officer Collins about it. When the judge’s order came through a short time later, attorney Clare Saunders said she wasn’t able to reach that CBP official or any other at the airport
“
So either Politico is lying, in order to support Trump, or you are in error and misrepresenting the truth blatantly.
How are you going to influence the middle without handling the truth carefully?
Chief justice Roberts rebukes the psychopath Trump in terms of defying a judges order.
It's outrageous we spend time and tax dollars defending criminals who should never have been on our shores at all to activist far left judges or anyone else. Yet here we are. If you are a leftist, and not sure just where you settle in--I think you are a civil libertarian at least which is commendable --, they may win a few of these idiot battles and lose the war. Because 80% of the people want them out. Many of them will self deport if they know they might end up in an El Salvadoran prison. So the problem will disappear swiftly. Every one here illegally is a law breaker. My mother told me if I broke laws or hung around with those that do, if I hang out in the gutter, the stink will transfer to me. However, this kind of thinking does NOT apply to US citizens. They do deserve due process. It sounds like you are applying constitutional rights that belong to our citizens to noncitizens who have broken our laws. Some more than others.
Now I know they abused the Patriot Act beyond 911 issues and that is a worry (though again, they are not citizens like the Patriot Act was used against US citizens), but these people have to go. We are talking about organized gangs. Once Trump gets a handle on this, I believe families or less attached individuals will get closer scrutiny.
An important function of the courts is to defend people, per our laws, from the opinions of the majority. It doesn’t matter if 80% of people want them out if doing so would break the law - even if the people being sent out broke laws themselves.
It is settled law that all people inside our borders, not just citizens, have the same right to due process. By “same right” I mean they are understood to come from the exact same legal text. You may think that it shouldn’t be that way, but it *is* that way until Congress amends the Constitution.
It would be an extremely tiny group saying we shouldn’t deport foreign gang members if they are in fact dangerous people. The *problem* here is that without due process, those being deported have no chance to prove that they’re not gang members, or even that they’re citizens. If *you* were picked up because I tipped to the police that you were a TdA member, I think you would be very upset not to have a chance to prove that you’re not.
Yes, I mentioned due process yesterday, and glad Mr Stone realizes as I do, we are after all a republic.
ps. We DO have a right to deport people here illegally. That's all we need to know. I can prove I'm a US citizen. They cannot. AND they are gang members. So this is ludicrous.
I’m sure you can prove that. What would you do if you showed your documents to an immigration official and they chucked you on the plane anyway? *That* is what is being alleged here. What is being alleged is that the government knows *some* *specific* people being deported are not actually legally deportable, and without being allowed to go in front of a judge, they are not being a given a chance to stop their deportation. What would you do if that was happening to you?
Well, I wouldn't be hanging around with a bunch of gang members or noncitizens when everyone and their brother knows they are going to be deported for being illegal. I suggest they don't do that. Or self deport so it doesn't happen to them. And I do not believe we are rounding up US citizens and sending them to El Salvador. So get real.
By the way, we have the right to free association in this country. I should be able to hang out with whoever I want to - that’s not illegal, and is not punishable by law. If they are being charged with being near gang members…that’s not a crime and it’s not deportable.
Who’s to say they were hanging around them? You are assuming too much. One allegation is that a man was just grabbed off the street because of his tattoos, which have no connection to gangs. How would he prove his innocence? How would we prove his danger to the public? By bringing him in front of a court. https://newrepublic.com/post/192861/trump-deport-immigrants-tattoos
No it is not "settled law" that noncitizens have the same rights. That's not true. They are not protected under our constitution, even with a green card if they are national security risks. And we extend those rights as a courtesy generally, but that's not true and IS debated.
I cannot imagine what the argument would be. The Fifth Amendment confers the right to due process upon any “person.” https://constitution.congress.gov/browse/essay/artI-S8-C18-8-7-2/ALDE_00001262/
And that's how Obama and Bill Clinton did it. They put all the illegals who came here through due process court cases. No, they did not. And we aren't going to. Obama issued "removal orders." What is the difference? The difference is that Donald Trump has to live under special laws. Check it out:
You think they all had trials?
"While Goodman is right that Obama deported record numbers of people using removal orders, she goes too far with her claim. “President Obama deported more people than all presidents before him combined,” she said on “Reliable Sources.”
Removal data from DHS going back to fiscal year 1892 show that while Obama did issue far more removal orders than his predecessors, 3.1 million removals from FY 2009 to FY 2016, it is still less than the 4.6 million issued before Obama took office."
https://checkyourfact.com/2018/02/04/fact-check-did-obama-deport-more-iilegal-undocumented-immigrant-people-than-all-previous-presidents-combined/
Where were you then?
Ethan, people can be deported for being here illegally with no green card and if they violate our laws, they can be deported even with one. It's that simple. We have deported people without court cases for years, even Barrack Obama did that! It's just Trump you all carry on over. Nobody carried on when he did it. They called him "deporter and chief." How many due process court cases did you see then?
I presume you are a liberal who thought it was fine to open the border and break our laws to begin with. If they came here illegally, they are criminals. And we cannot afford to put them all through court cases to get rid of them. Actually, it's Biden who should go to jail for doing it.
But we do not have to tolerate these drug people and gangs here. Look at the tv. Do they look like fine upstanding people to you? And once they are gone, I am sure some of the others will get your "due process." Or looked at more carefully.
What "due process" did Laken Riley get and those other victims?
And PS, noncitizens get due process int his country before we put them in OUR JAILS or keep them there permanently (as you see we did for that person who killed Laken Riley) . But we always HAVE used "removal orders" and deported people without trials. Because nobody can afford to hold a trial for every illegal. HELLO. And not just Donald Trump. ALL presidents do it.
They lied about Springfield They lied about Colorado We do have this thing about due process This applies to everyone Would you like to be deported
I doubt that the government is spending tax dollars on defending these people
A lot of people should read the Constitution and the Federalist Papers
Did Obama, deporter in chief, give them all court due process? Fuck no, he didn't. And HE built those cages on t he border. That was all fine, though. There are always two sets of rules for liberals. It's sickening.
Trump built the cages on the border
Illegal aliens are entitled to due process The courts have recognized that
https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution-conan/amendment-5/removal-of-aliens-who-have-entered-the-united-states
There are a few hundred who are gang members Trump pardoned 1500 convicted people from 1/4
All the stuff about sending rapists, murderers, drug dealers are lies 80%of drugs come through major checkpoints and 80% are brought in by Americans
Obama, did, in fact have more deportations than any other president, including Trump
Illegal immigrants have the lowest crime rates Next are legal immi9grants the most are us born citizens Criminals should be deported first Even though they say they are doing that they have not done it If they are truly that concerned about law breakers
No, ALL illegal people have never received "due process." They have been removed by "removal orders" and none any moreso than Obama. And OBAMA built the cages. Maybe you should be more informed.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/obama-build-cages-immigrants/
Right On!!! Where does it say in our Constitution, Bill of Rights, Preamble, etc. that people who enter our nation illegally have any rights under the law of common sense thinking.
I know you will walk away from this feeling like you’re right. I will think I’m right too. There doesn’t seem to be any more reason to argue if you’re going to tiptoe around each point I bring up instead of addressing them head on.
Ethan, here is what is on the US gov. site and what Obama and many presidents did before. They CAN be removed without seeing a judge and all these people fit the justification:
Understand the deportation process
Learn how the deportation process works and how to get help if you are facing deportation.
Deportation is the process of removing a noncitizen from the U.S. for violating immigration law.
The U.S. may detain and deport noncitizens who:
Participate in criminal acts
Are a threat to public safety
Violate their visa
What happens when someone is detained by immigration
The foreign national may be held in a detention center before trial or deportation. Find out how to locate someone detained by ICE.
After a noncitizen is detained, they may go before a judge in immigration court during the deportation (removal) process. In some cases, a noncitizen is subject to expedited removal without being able to attend a hearing in immigration court. Expedited removal may happen when a noncitizen:
https://www.usa.gov/deportation-process
Comes to the U.S. without proper travel documents
Uses forged travel documents
Does not comply with their visa or other entry document requirements
LOL, address my points head on, Ethan. Obama issued "removal orders" more than any other president before him. He did NOT hold "trials." And give every illegal alien "due process." No president does. Now if they go to jail here for MURDER, they get due process. But this is naive and ridiculous. ALL presidents "remove" illegal aliens. Even Biden did it.
Gabe, will you explain what it means that Israel resuming its attacks puts the ceasefire into uncertainty? As far as I can tell, it plainly means the ceasefire is over. Am I not correct?
If the Supreme Court doesn’t have the ability to enforce their decisions, why would the current administration pay any attention if it does serve their interests?
I am noticing less reference to “ Biden judges, Trump judges, Obama judges in MSM. Am I imagining this? Or maybe wishful thinking? I noticed you are still using such terms. Maybe everyone should follow Justice John Roberts in this regard.
Due process is not a one size fits all magic concept. The process to which one is due in a mortgage default, a child custody case, a criminal prosecution etc. differs. We have an articulated process due to those who claim asylum. But that process became overburdened by the numbers of seekers, many of whom are not eligible. If we had a functioning Congress, the process would have been streamlined and properly funded long ago, after the Mariel Boatlift, or at least by 2014 when we all saw what was happening in Europe. The asylum law which was designed to respond to a different time would have been changed.
TDA several Hundred 1?4 criminals pardoned 1500 and a lot of them were violent
Check the list of "Biden's Pardons" and compare it to Trumps.
Will this administration attempt to suppress our right to vote?
States hold and administer elections, not the national government. I understand the fear, but Trump has no power to cancel elections.
You wrote: (*emphasis* added below to your word “hours”)
“
At the same time, the administration is also battling allegations of non-compliance in another high-profile dispute, over its Friday deportation of Brown University professor Rasha Alawieh on Friday, despite a district judge ordering *hours* earlier that she not be removed from the U.S. without giving the court advance notice.
“
Yet Politico reported yesterday (link)
https://www.politico.com/news/2025/03/17/rasha-alawieh-deportation-026038
that:
“
In a court filing made public Monday, a member of the legal team representing Alawieh said she was at the airport Friday night as the court petition was filed and informed a CBP officer who identified himself only as Officer Collins about it. When the judge’s order came through a short time later, attorney Clare Saunders said she wasn’t able to reach that CBP official or any other at the airport
“
So either Politico is lying, in order to support Trump, or you are in error and misrepresenting the truth blatantly.
How are you going to influence the middle without handling the truth carefully?
Frank
The ACLU has been a racist spitfire ever since their founding. Beware of their bullet firing 5th column existence.